Login Sign Up

Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby ablinkin » Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:49 am

Elcid, in my Kung Fu class we do a bunch of body conditioning. We condition our hands, abs, arms, shins, thighs etc. I started using a piece of 1" PVC pipe wrapped in duct tape. I would roll the PCV up and down my shin and also bang on my shins a bit on the inside, front, and outside of the shin. Once my shins could handle that easily I used a piece of PVC that was not covered in anything repeating the above steps. I pretty much have no nerves in my shins and thighs now but hey I can kick the $h!t out of about anything and take a h3ll of a hit to my legs now....after a couple years of this conditioning......

hope this helps
------------------------------
When your hand is extended withdraw your anger,
When your anger is extended withdraw your hand.
ablinkin
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:22 am

Postby Elcid » Sun Aug 05, 2007 5:52 pm

AWesome! Now this is the type of stuff that us long time Karatekas like talking about. I started going back a bit in my head, and one of the things that I remember a lot of us doing was getting a woman hose, cut it to a length we wanted, then tying one end of it, and filling it up with sand. We made it so that it almost was the length of a club. We then wraped the entire thing with black shinny electric tape. We then used it as a portable kicking and punching Makiwara. For the shins, we basically hit our shins with it. It actually did not hurt at all really because the sand gave way when you hit, but after while it got your shins really strong. I really believe though that the thin red solid as a rock sand bag was the ticket. Thanks for getting back to me. OSU!
Hagakure
Elcid
White Belt
White Belt
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:43 am

Postby raidan » Sun Aug 12, 2007 4:18 pm

uhn...so many pages to read through, from past experience, and a coupla studies, the reason for kicking a heavy punchbag/sandbag, is that the density of the shin bone is increased, instead of the nerves being killed off.
i have a series of mild lumps in my shin bone from me not wearing shin pads while sparring a few years back (the bone becomes bruised, which is painful if touched and lasts much longer than a flesh bruise) once it heals, a lump of very dense bone forms there. i cant remeber the correct medical term for it though.. perhaps someone could tell me.
raidan
White Belt
White Belt
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 4:10 pm

Postby bje10s » Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:34 pm

this might put every1 to rest

ive jus stared to learn muay thai from my girlfriends dad he was a champ in laos and his brother was aus champ. he said muay thai f#$ks your legs up when you get older he is now 51 and moves like a 20yr old. kicking a bag and pads is how he trained this shins.

i used to do boxing and got 2 novice state tittles out of it and i used to do something called body conditioning. it involves a medicine ball being thrown and slammed into your abs/obliques when laying down this seemed to make blows to the body really easy to take.
bje10s
White Belt
White Belt
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2007 6:42 pm
Location: aus

Postby bje10s » Tue Oct 16, 2007 6:46 pm

hmm the link didnt appear for some reason

http://www.ironlife.com/mag/issue6/shin.shtml

insert this after i rite "this might put every1 to rest"
bje10s
White Belt
White Belt
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2007 6:42 pm
Location: aus

Postby flipper » Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:33 pm

I know this was posted a long time ago but I feel I have to comment.

In my opinion Ste Bell you are correct and Gurre you are wrong plain and simple.

Here are my reasons:

- Nerves send signals to your brain telling us there is a problem. By killing or temp killing these nerves we don't know if there is a problem or not. For training I can see Gurre your point; however, regarding living your life that is a different story entirely.

To debate this I'll look at the other side. No nerves equals no pain; this is great. I just broke my tibia and I don't know it. I can keep fighting so what is the problem? I don't hurt any.

I see a real problem here. Dude we just broke a bone and don't even know. Long term affects are greater potential for arthritis or other issues down the road.

Here is a true example. I am 33 years old now in 2008. I have studied the below styles. Yes before I get a number of comments no I never leveled to black belt. I had no desire to. I really did this for fun and to stay active. I don’t compete any longer I just box now for fun in my basement with my heavy bag, speed bag and slip bag while trying to ignore my wife’s nagging :)

To make a long story short I have the highest pain tolerance level you’ll ever find. I’m not bragging it’s just a fact and I would gladly give it back if I could. Currently I have a level 3 sprain and a torn tendon in my driving foot. The entire foot is black and blue not just part of it. I can put full pressure on it and still walk. I don’t because I know this is bad so I use crutches. In any case when I did do kung fu my Si-Fu taught pressure points. I don’t feel them at all so he never really used me as an example. One day he did. He used the pressure point right under my arm pit. I felt nothing. Picked another student and down they went in a second. This is good right? WRONG! Two days later I had the black and blue markings you would have though I was hit by a car.

Tore my roator cuf and dislocated it and did not even know till I started to feel a little discomfet.

Case in point just because you don’t feel pain does not mean you are not obtaining damage

choi la foot kung fu = Blue Sash and 3 strips – brown was next
Gracie jujitsu – part of the kung fu (just different instructor)
Shotokan = Purple Belt and 3 strips
Tae Kwon Do G= Green Belt
Tang Soo do = Orange Belt
Boxing (used practice with a friend who retired from pro-circuit)
Competed in college and placed first in 1997 CT state WTF state championship in my weight class.
flipper
White Belt
White Belt
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 3:50 pm

Postby DarkHorse » Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:44 pm

I have some wooden sticks I tap away at my shins, knees, elbows and forearms with. After doing this I ice and rest them. Its really helped out, good luck!
DarkHorse
Orange Belt
Orange Belt
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:57 pm
Location: So. Cal

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby Moldaz » Sun Oct 17, 2010 7:11 am

Pain is the body's way of telling you something's wrong.
If there was something seriously wrong with your shin, and you couldn't feel it, imagine the possible ramifications of not being able to feel.
Of all the things I have lost, I miss my mind the most.
- Mark Twain.
Moldaz
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2010 1:35 am
Location: Ballarat, Australia.

Re:

Postby DARREN » Tue Dec 21, 2010 2:14 pm

[quote="Gurre"], you aren't in pain for weeks after a fight. Which makes you think that you come back soon ,the pain create for reason to give you alarm that something is wrong .
DARREN
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:46 pm

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby Kensei » Thu Dec 23, 2010 7:13 am

Okay, lets end this REALLY OLD POST with some facts.....
1. "conditioning" the shins have short term gains and long term issues! Think short sighted and you end up with chronic issues as you get older!

2. When you are young you never think of being "older" and always think "FU*K it, I want to win now" and dont think "FU*K that I want to walk and live a long life when I get older", youth is a foolish time, dont blame those that want to be superman now, and dont think about getting older HEALTHY.

3. The conditioning we are talking about does damage to the bone, nerves, Connective tissue, blood vessels and all the other tissue between the bone and the skin! that is why it works, and that is why it is bad.

4. Damaging the nerve in that area can cause a very strange effect called "Drop foot" were you can not properly contract the shin muscles to bring the toes and foot up, you end up with a flipper for a foot and can not walk properly or use the foot properly, its is the same issue that many stroke victims and car accident victims I see have. but Condition away friends....therapists and medical workers need jobs you know!

5. The damage to the blood vessels can cause DVT or Deep vein thrombosis, these thrombosites can break off and end up as traveling clots that end up in the lung...and may kill you...but condition away friends....the world is over populated as it is!

6. The damage that is caused to the connective tissue around the bone may cause fractures and or even a better issue, lack of blood to the bone and necrosis of the bone tissue causing it to be brittle....and ROT. Yes, you might end up with a psudo-gangarene in your leg...one that has to be CUT out and packed and might lead to a amputation...but condition away friends...to many kick boxers to compete now a days anyways!

7. Lack of feeling in the shin is great when you are kick boxing, but once you are done with kick boxing you kind of want to feel the shin area, or you might end up not feeling when you injure it on the coffee table and end up with a bad infection, or worse...its the same issue that people with diabetes have when they lose feeling in their lower limbs...and get amputations....but condition away friends...surgeons that do amputations need to pay for the next BMW they buy you know.

8. improperly damaging the shin can cause major pain and neuritis that will side line your career for ever….even touching the area…hell a gentle breeze touching the area will feel like someone is hacking through the bone with a dull saw…but condition away friends…drug companies need your money more than you do!
9. Destruction of the fine lymph system that happens when you roll over it with a bottle or a wood stick will stop your immune system from properly protecting your leg, so a ingrown toe nail will fester till you have to get the toe removed, thus ending your career and any chance of a dance championship in your future…or a turn on the dance floor at a wedding…but go ahead and condition friend…rumor has it you were not a great dancer to start with!
10. The time you spend “conditioning” could be used doing “real conditioning” and training that wont end up ending your career, you know the kind, Cardio or actually sparring….but don’t worry friend, condition away….while you roll your glass coke bottle down your shin your opponent will be working on getting faster and learning how to land that kick to the head or cross to the chin that will put you out…and from their you wont have to worry about your numb ass, rotting lower limb!

Fact is that a small amount of conditioning of the shin that is done when you kick a bag will probably be reversible and wont do damage that time can not heal, but focusing a hard object on that area and rolling it around will do damage that can not be reversed. Ever wonder why you don’t see a lot of 40 year old Muay Thai fighters that still compete…and those that are coaching are hobbled a bit, don’t do much sparring and only put on shirts to take pictures ? Its because after they do a photo shoot of kicking the bag or sparring they need two weeks of rest and ICE to get the legs back to walking shape!

Like Gurre said however, people will do what they want, and I have learned to let them, there is always money in fixing or helping the chronically stupid and impetuous youth that will pay for their silliness later in life…and like I said…I need the money!
Image

Even monkeys fall out of trees!
Kensei
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 6233
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:12 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby DARREN » Thu Dec 23, 2010 2:20 pm

Kensei wrote:Okay, lets end this REALLY OLD POST with some facts.....
1. "conditioning" the shins have short term gains and long term issues! Think short sighted and you end up with chronic issues as you get older!

2. When you are young you never think of being "older" and always think "FU*K it, I want to win now" and dont think "FU*K that I want to walk and live a long life when I get older", youth is a foolish time, dont blame those that want to be superman now, and dont think about getting older HEALTHY.

3. The conditioning we are talking about does damage to the bone, nerves, Connective tissue, blood vessels and all the other tissue between the bone and the skin! that is why it works, and that is why it is bad.

4. Damaging the nerve in that area can cause a very strange effect called "Drop foot" were you can not properly contract the shin muscles to bring the toes and foot up, you end up with a flipper for a foot and can not walk properly or use the foot properly, its is the same issue that many stroke victims and car accident victims I see have. but Condition away friends....therapists and medical workers need jobs you know!

5. The damage to the blood vessels can cause DVT or Deep vein thrombosis, these thrombosites can break off and end up as traveling clots that end up in the lung...and may kill you...but condition away friends....the world is over populated as it is!

6. The damage that is caused to the connective tissue around the bone may cause fractures and or even a better issue, lack of blood to the bone and necrosis of the bone tissue causing it to be brittle....and ROT. Yes, you might end up with a psudo-gangarene in your leg...one that has to be CUT out and packed and might lead to a amputation...but condition away friends...to many kick boxers to compete now a days anyways!

7. Lack of feeling in the shin is great when you are kick boxing, but once you are done with kick boxing you kind of want to feel the shin area, or you might end up not feeling when you injure it on the coffee table and end up with a bad infection, or worse...its the same issue that people with diabetes have when they lose feeling in their lower limbs...and get amputations....but condition away friends...surgeons that do amputations need to pay for the next BMW they buy you know.

8. improperly damaging the shin can cause major pain and neuritis that will side line your career for ever….even touching the area…hell a gentle breeze touching the area will feel like someone is hacking through the bone with a dull saw…but condition away friends…drug companies need your money more than you do!
9. Destruction of the fine lymph system that happens when you roll over it with a bottle or a wood stick will stop your immune system from properly protecting your leg, so a ingrown toe nail will fester till you have to get the toe removed, thus ending your career and any chance of a dance championship in your future…or a turn on the dance floor at a wedding…but go ahead and condition friend…rumor has it you were not a great dancer to start with!
10. The time you spend “conditioning” could be used doing “real conditioning” and training that wont end up ending your career, you know the kind, Cardio or actually sparring….but don’t worry friend, condition away….while you roll your glass coke bottle down your shin your opponent will be working on getting faster and learning how to land that kick to the head or cross to the chin that will put you out…and from their you wont have to worry about your numb ass, rotting lower limb!

Fact is that a small amount of conditioning of the shin that is done when you kick a bag will probably be reversible and wont do damage that time can not heal, but focusing a hard object on that area and rolling it around will do damage that can not be reversed. Ever wonder why you don’t see a lot of 40 year old Muay Thai fighters that still compete…and those that are coaching are hobbled a bit, don’t do much sparring and only put on shirts to take pictures ? Its because after they do a photo shoot of kicking the bag or sparring they need two weeks of rest and ICE to get the legs back to walking shape!

Like Gurre said however, people will do what they want, and I have learned to let them, there is always money in fixing or helping the chronically stupid and impetuous youth that will pay for their silliness later in life…and like I said…I need the money!

nice to do what you like
DARREN
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:46 pm

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby DARREN » Wed Dec 29, 2010 4:26 pm

[quote="DA[Nice to do what you like!!!!
DARREN
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:46 pm

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby DARREN » Sat Jan 01, 2011 2:49 pm

[quote="DARREN"][geting money thats nice ,do what you know and like thats realy amazing....
DARREN
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:46 pm

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby LONNIEmcconne » Sun Jan 02, 2011 11:42 pm

Its a very good decision that u have have taken.
Best off Luck dude ....
LONNIEmcconne
Orange Belt
Orange Belt
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2010 12:59 pm

Re: Knee and Shin Conditioning for MT

Postby DARREN » Mon Jan 03, 2011 3:09 pm

[quote="DARRENYeah i saw that show. It was pretty awesome. I like how they show what does the most damage. The knee in the Thai clinch.
DARREN
Yellow Belt
Yellow Belt
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:46 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Boxing, Kickboxing & Muay Thai

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests