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order of belts?

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Postby Gurre » Wed Oct 25, 2006 10:27 am

how about red? is that 10th dan in your org James?
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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Wed Oct 25, 2006 10:30 am

That's still pretty amazing how it varies. From style to style and organization to organization.
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Postby Kensei » Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:05 am

Gow I agree, it varies alot...even in my style I have seen blue belts and even a pink color belt. I did not have the heart to ask the kid if it was just an old fadded belt or it was supposed to be red.
Gurre, we dont use red at all. All the black belts are just black...from Shodan to Judan...just black. And you dont want a 10th dan in trd Shotokan....that means you are dead! Not good. Only way to get it is to pass away as a chief instructor and then it is passed on to you.
You only test from Begginer to sixth Dan and then it is kind of "given" to the instructors for time served to the style. But again...Dont try and get a 10th Dan in our style. Lots of work and the outcome is not good.
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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:52 pm

See, I do not even see why it is necessary to have all those belts. Yes, I can understand how it could help children want to learn so they can be promoted and earn their next belt/rank, but come on you could use the same colors, but call them Junior X (X = whatever belt).

I like how Isshinryu is set up. You have a belt for almost each empty hand kata. I really do like that, but I also think it hinders some students. Why? Because they start to concentrate only on their katas and nothing else. But all in all it's a good system as long as it's not abused.
Not to cross train cripples the martial arts, without it you can become a mechanic, but never an artist.
- E. Cates

Gold medals aren't really made of gold. They're made of sweat, determination, and a hard-to-find alloy called guts.
- Dan Gable
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Postby Kensei » Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:58 pm

That is like ours style with one Kata per belt.
I also agree about kids and students focusing on the belt to much.
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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Wed Oct 25, 2006 2:44 pm

Not only that, but some organizations and/or styles are known for promoting some people very quickly. I think that in itself is wrong, but I have seen some situations that I do not necessarily agree with, but I can understand the reason why it is done.

For example, we had this one student that was part of our jujitsu and karate class, but he soon realized that he was neglecting everything that was karate. So for 6 months he trained less jujitsu and more karate, and even added some extra time in. At the end of this he was promoted twice. When I heard this I got a little upset, but when I heard my Sensei talk and give the reasons I was fine, and he also put in that it would still take the student alotted time for his blackbelt.

But on the other hand, I have a friend that just started Sanjuriu (have no clue about this style or whether or not it is worth anything) and he just got his blackbelt last week. He said his instructor was rushing him through because he wants him to help teach and some other stuff. This I do not agree with. If the instructor truly wanted him to teach he would take his time and mold him.

But all in all it's a great system that's greatly abused.
Not to cross train cripples the martial arts, without it you can become a mechanic, but never an artist.
- E. Cates

Gold medals aren't really made of gold. They're made of sweat, determination, and a hard-to-find alloy called guts.
- Dan Gable
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Postby Kensei » Wed Oct 25, 2006 2:54 pm

Good point in my club you follow the aloted time, and I am even harder to work under. If you are not ready you dont test....period. Normaly three months between tests is normally six months in my club were I teach...but my students are good enough to take guys four or five levels highter. I had a 3 kyu that kicked butt at a tourney and even beat a nidan!
TKD is famous for two year black belts. No respect from me for that one however.
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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Wed Oct 25, 2006 3:14 pm

We usually go with 3 months in between our tests, but once you hit your dan ranks you have to wait a year for every dan level you have achieved. I can personally say that I have refused to test because I thought I was not ready to be promoted. Sometimes I just feel as if I do not deserve it and need more time studying and training.
Not to cross train cripples the martial arts, without it you can become a mechanic, but never an artist.
- E. Cates

Gold medals aren't really made of gold. They're made of sweat, determination, and a hard-to-find alloy called guts.
- Dan Gable
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Postby Kensei » Wed Oct 25, 2006 4:00 pm

only one year??? We have 2 between 1 Dan and 2Dan. and 2-4 for Sandan ext.

Rank in TMA should not be a foot race...but an time to learn. Rushing the students is BS and just a sign of a instructor or org out for money.

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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Wed Oct 25, 2006 4:34 pm

I mean you have to wait a year for every dan rank you are you have to wait that time for promotion. So that would mean 1st dan = 1 year, 2nd dan = 2 years, 3rd dan = 3 years, and so on.
Not to cross train cripples the martial arts, without it you can become a mechanic, but never an artist.
- E. Cates

Gold medals aren't really made of gold. They're made of sweat, determination, and a hard-to-find alloy called guts.
- Dan Gable
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Postby Kensei » Sat Oct 28, 2006 10:15 am

Sorry GOW, Could not get back to you sooner, I am out with the stomach flu right now and feel like...well you know what.

That is exactly what I mean. When we test for shodan it is one year from 1kyu, 2 years between shodan and Nidan. but the trend in our org. right now is to wait alot longer.
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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Sat Oct 28, 2006 6:46 pm

Ah, understood. Any reason while you all decided to wait a little longer? Or do you all just go through these phases?
Not to cross train cripples the martial arts, without it you can become a mechanic, but never an artist.
- E. Cates

Gold medals aren't really made of gold. They're made of sweat, determination, and a hard-to-find alloy called guts.
- Dan Gable
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Postby Kensei » Sun Oct 29, 2006 7:56 am

For me it is a matter of competence. I do not want to be known as a instructor that just charges and gives belts out. all my students are competent and my demo/tournament team are a bunch of hard ass students.

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Postby GrappleorWrestle » Sun Oct 29, 2006 7:19 pm

Hah, well that's always good. But you also do not want to be known as a complete ass. I do agree with you on being competent. I would want my students, all of them, to be competent. If your students are competent that says alot for you.
Not to cross train cripples the martial arts, without it you can become a mechanic, but never an artist.
- E. Cates

Gold medals aren't really made of gold. They're made of sweat, determination, and a hard-to-find alloy called guts.
- Dan Gable
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Postby Kensei » Mon Oct 30, 2006 9:30 am

I am known as being a Hard Ass, but not a complete ass.....I hope!

My students are all happy and hard working. they dont seem to mind the little extra time.
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